Sailonline.org - Online Sailing

Facebook

Login

Support Sailonline

If you haven't already - join the SAILONLINE YACHT CLUB!

Please also consider making a donation - all amounts are greatly appreciated!

Tweets by @sailonline

Board » General Discussion » Practice Races - proposal for them to be set up like SOL Races

Posted by Rod Posts 392 Registered at 2010-06-24 22:30:48	2012-04-20 00:18:20 - Practice Races - proposal for them to be set up like SOL Races
	Post annotated by RainbowChaser : This post was moved from the thread SWR 6 - Practice Racing to have it stand out from practice racing "chit chat". This is addressed specifically to those who run SOL: The practice races (around the buoys)are becoming more popular and much more competitive. Even with only 10-20 racers it is very difficult to determine buoy-roundings and finishes. In addition, the burden of organizing these races is becoming an increasing burden upon RainbowChaser. Would it be possible to change the system so that these races would be run on the regular system, with 1. Separate sign-up, 2. a 'start' point, 3. a 'start-line separate from the start point, 4. buoys located appropriately with rounding checked by the system 5. finish line (ditto) These races correspond to the IRL in-port races of the VOR, so are not outside the normal routine of SOL, except that they would last only for 2-3 hours, starting at 1800 or 1900 UTC., and rarely have more than ten entrants. It would also be very helpful if these races could be planned and carried out by different volunteers among the regular 'practice racing' group, having access to the SOL system ONLY for these specific races. When 5 to 10 boats simultaneous cross the finish line, it is almost beyond the capability of anyone to determine the order of finish, as boats may be finishing from different directions. ______________ --- Last Edited by RainbowChaser at 2012-04-20 17:10:32 --- If it breaks, it's not strong enough--if it doesn't, it's too heavy.
Posted by RainbowChaser Posts 2656 Registered at 2009-06-14 09:44:50	2012-04-20 10:17:10 - Re: Practice Races - proposal for them to be set up like SOL races
	Rod - this is an excellent post (which is why I gave it a title of its own)! As I set up practice races and SOL races both are "doable" from a my-time point of view. One drawback, is the size additional load on the server of all the raced/archived practice races - unless the DevtDudes can create a mechanism by which the race is reusable. It would, I think, be possible to have a PR weather system which I could create/re-create for each zone, but that too will add load. Another drawback is the potential performance impact on boats in official/ranking races from a server-ranking practice race, For about 2hrs each evening up to 20 (at the moment) practice racers are sending a lot of commands into the system. Right now they disappear into the "load" of a single open race but if set up as a separate server-race, then they would compete load-wise. The range/style of courses available might be somewhat limited. The SOL server cannot (yet) show gates...offer "choice of rounding" and both of these options are very popular in practice races. I agree that something needs to assist with final ranking in Practice Racing - have thought so for a very long time as we struggle to declare finishers - but to have course-restricted racing wouldn't be as much fun. Suggestions anyone? The key issue really is how best to rank boats finishing one of the short/informal practice race courses! As for giving a group of SOLers access to the database I think that is a non-starter. One thing that would help is if more practice racers accepted my almost nightly invitation to design our course for the next day (based on forecast wx) so that all I would need to do is set it up. As a non-sailor my courses are, I am sure, not necessarily the best or most fun for the prevailing conditions!! _______________ --- Last Edited by RainbowChaser at 2012-04-20 17:11:18 ---
Posted by Rod Posts 392 Registered at 2010-06-24 22:30:48	2012-04-20 14:33:01 - Re: Practice Racing - SOL Server move proposal
	To RainbowChaser:- Please understand that I think you do a very difficult job very well. My concern is that 'round-the-buoys' racing is 'Practice' for the type of Radio-control racing that I do. I have not ever, and probably never will, be the navigator in a round-the-world ocean race. The participants in the practice races are getting much more skillful, and competitive, which results in many more boats finishing at the same time. This is almost impossible to determine accurately as every participant sees the finish differently. Logging in as Sol prevents a sailor from making any real course changes just prior to the finish. The only solution that I have been able to think up, is to make these into 'mini' regular races, or to appoint a volunteer "Race Director" for the race, as is done in Radio-sailing. The RD receives the average score for the race if it is part of a series. The RD would just watch the race without participating. The RD would need to get an accurate picture of all boat names and positions immediately prior to the finish of the first boat, because that is the ONLY way to determine finishing order. I have no wish to be a 'sea lawyer' in this matter. My only concern is the general improvement of this virtual racing site into the best that it is possible for it to be. If it breaks, it's not strong enough--if it doesn't, it's too heavy.
Posted by NZL_Scotsman Posts 251 Registered at 2008-10-04 07:59:40	2012-04-20 18:20:22 - Re: Practice Races - proposal for them to be set up like SOL Races
	Good ideas there Rod. Hopefully the wonderful SOL gods can work something out without challenging the server etc. I also like the recent idea of having a few start times during the day. Today's 6am start was never likely to happen for me.
Posted by rodm67 Posts 14 Registered at 2011-11-04 15:25:34	2012-04-20 18:34:55 - Re: Practice Races - proposal for them to be set up like SOL Races
	I understand what Rod says about being very hard to call positions at PRs. But I like the informal nature of PRs. And, even if actually it doesn't occur at real life, I like the possibility about having regional PRs at same course, adjusted to timezones. I have flexible time, so I can join my global fellows, but I know that maybe is impossible to other brazilian SOLers to be practicing at middle of afternoon. Anyway, totally agree that RainbowChaser is doing a excelent job, and would support any improvemnt that light the burden of organizing it. Good Wind All
Posted by SWE_Robert Posts 19 Registered at 2009-06-28 13:03:13	2012-04-20 18:47:31 - Re: Practice Races - proposal for them to be set up like SOL Races
	Anything that can make things better is welcome. I don´t know if this the thing to do. Some months ago we where talking of a special PR-race course and I think RC did puit up a race in The Auletians, because we wanted it in a secure wind-blowing place. That would be a different thing to what Rod is proposing, but as I said I´m for everything that makes SOL better though I don´t have any porblems with how things is working now, if it´s not a too heavy burden for RC. Robert
Posted by WINDEGG Posts 10 Registered at 2010-03-22 10:53:59	2012-04-22 13:52:57 - Re: Practice Races - proposal for them to be set up like SOL Races
	Agree with robert, i like it as its now.(if its not to much work for Rainbow C.) Its a practice race not real race ! You can compare tracks with each other and play with vmg and look at polar and talk on chat . And most of the time the practicerace get decided by server at a bouy. Maybe we should cancel the rankings! If people want to race short races for real , maybe its an idea to have a short timedrace open all the time. See ya's on the virtual sea....: )
Posted by Rod Posts 392 Registered at 2010-06-24 22:30:48	2012-05-23 15:18:02 - Re: Practice Races - proposal for them to be set up like SOL Races
	I, too, like the informal nature of the practice races--BUT--the participants are becoming more skillful--more boats are together when rounding buoys and finishing and it is becoming more difficult to determine the order of finish. It seems unfair to RC for her to spend so much of her racing time finding out 1) who is sailing, 2)who has rounded, 3)who has finished and in what order. These jobs would all be completed automatically if the race was set up in the regular format. I do not know how much work RC has to do to set up a race formally vs. informally, but it cannot be much different. The only special requirement for what I have proposed would be in the original sign-up for the race, so that only those who really intended to race would sign-up. This is intended only to prevent people signing in under the impression that it was a regular race, only to realize later that the race lasted only 2-3 hours. A special race for small numbers for a short time could well have a refresh interval of ONE SECOND for all participants rather than 15 sec or one minute---without overstressing the server. On a personal note--I use SOL as practice for the radio-racing that I do--I will NEVER be asked to navigate an ocean racing yacht around the world---and I suspect very few other SOLers will, either! If they were, they would be doing it IRL and not spending time sitting in front of computers!! If it breaks, it's not strong enough--if it doesn't, it's too heavy.

Please login to post a reply.

Races

Next Race: 00d 00h 00m

Current Races:

Manilla to Calbayog 2024

After six years, we welcome you to the race created by sassy63 for the second time. He takes us to the Philippines to race around islands on a 380 nm course. We sail the Italia 14.98 and in Calbayog we'll enjoy our well-deserved Palatan dish and drink it with San Miguel.
Race #1803
INFO from brainaid.de
Italia 14.98 PARTICULARS
WX Updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking:
ARQ2 - ARCH - SUPSOL - SYC
Race starts: Apr 22nd 17:00 Registration Open!

▶ Flash

GO TO RACE

Jakob's Birthday BBQ Race 2024

Sailonline had two founders and Jakob, the more senior of the two, has his birthday in April which we always like to celebrate with a race through the Stockholm Archipelago from Revengegrundet Lighthouse to his mooring at Baggensfjärden. Traditionally also, like other celebrations this time of year, this feast has been “moveable”, so on this occasion we will be racing on a Wednesday in one of our latest high-performance 40-footers, the Carkeek 40. Please join us then for this always tricky 30nm race. Grattis på födelsedagen Jakob!
Race #1794
INFO by brainaid.de
Carkeek 40 PARTICULARS
WX Updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking: SYC
Race starts: Apr 20th 14:00 Registration Open!

▶ Flash

GO TO RACE

Melbourne to Osaka Prelude 2024

Welcome once again to what these days is Sailonline’s almost annual virtual Melbourne to Osaka Yacht Race. In real life, this double-handed 5500 nm race between these two sister cities, one deep in the southern hemisphere, the other high in the northern hemisphere, is run every four to five years, and is planned to be held again in 2025, so this race is a Prelude in partnership with the Melbourne Osaka Cup 2025 organising committee collaborating with the Ocean Racing Club of Victoria (ORCV), and the Sandringham (SYC) and Osaka Hokko (OHYC) yacht clubs. On this occasion, we’ll be racing the well-known First 40, a popular size of boat for a long-distance double-handed race. With the doldrums unavoidably lying across the track, you can expect to be at virtual sea for at least a month!
Race #1669
INFO by brainaid.de
First 40 Particulars
WX Updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking: SYC
Race starts: Apr 20th 00:00 Registration Open!

▶ Flash

GO TO RACE

St Nazaire Chasse TIMED Race 2024

Welcome to a "chasse" (hunt) from St. Nazaire to La Baule on the west coast of France! This race was designed by SOLer FR_flouflou in 2010. The KER 40 was introduced to SOL in 2016 by SOLer psail, and the Sol-KER was a welcome addition to SOL’s fleet of 40- footers, as it was to the IRL Ker fleet of eponymous - like KERonimo, KukuKERchu and Ice BreaKER. This is a TIMEDrace, so you may RE-REGISTER HERE to try again, after finishing a run. You will have 13 days and 11 hours to show your skill and decision making after the race opens.
Race #1797
INFOby brainaid.de
Ker 40 PARTICULARS
WX Updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking:
TRQ2 - TRCH - SUPSOL - SYC
RACE CLOSE: Saturday,
27 April at 23:00 UTC
Race starts: Apr 14th 12:00 Registration Open!

▶ Flash

GO TO RACE

The Beagle in the Straits of Magellan 2024

Both before and after visiting the Falkland Islands, the Beagle extensively explored the south eastern coast of South America, hither and thither, from north of the Rio Plate to the tip of Tierra del Fuego, but it was not till the end of June 1834 that the ship made it into the Pacific Ocean, transiting via the Straits of Magellan. Online in 2024, the choice is yours - passage the strait or round the cape; 400nm or more in your Class B Tall Ship.
Race #1753
INFOby brainaid.de
Tall Ship Class B PARTICULARS
WX Updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking: SVF - SYC
RACE CLOSE: Sunday,
April 21 at 2300 UTC.
Race starts: Apr 09th 13:00 Registration Closed

▶ Flash

GO TO RACE

Cape Town to Auckland 2024

Welcome to the second leg of this Round The World series 2024. It's also the April edition of this year's ocean race championship. The course is the same as the one sailed in 2023, but this year we sail the iconic Swan 65, as suggested in the concluding RTW race last year.
Prepare yourselves for an epic 30-day journey, navigating through the unpredictable waters of the South Seas. It's essential to take care of provisioning to ensure a smooth and enjoyable race experience. With the longer duration, we anticipate plenty of opportunities for camaraderie, competition, and unforgettable memories.
PRIZE: SMPF
Race# 1789
INFO from brainaid.de
Swan 65 PARTICULARS
WX updates:
0430 / 1030 / 1630 / 2230
Ranking: OCQ2 - RTW - OCCH - SUPSOL - SYC
Race starts: Apr 01st 11:00 Registration Closed

▶ Flash

GO TO RACE

Go to race archive

SYC Ranking

View full list

Series

Mobile Client

SYC members have the benefit of access to our mobile/lightweight web client!

The mobile client